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amgiossi    -- 04-28-2004 @ 12:57 PM
  When a batter reaches first base on an error.  Is it considered an at bat?  How would it effect their batting avg?

hoopdreams_wi    -- 04-29-2004 @ 1:06 AM
  A batter that reaches first due to a fielding error is cahrged with an at-bat.  It would lower their batting average, which is fair becasue they did not hit safely.  They only reached base because the defense messed up.

amgiossi    -- 05-04-2004 @ 1:12 PM
  So how would this affect their on base percentage?

hoopdreams_wi    -- 05-04-2004 @ 1:37 PM
  On-base Percentage
(hits + walks + hits by pitch) / (at-bats + walks + hits by pitch + sacrifice flies)

Reaching on error is not figured in to OBP, so reaching on an error would lower your OBP.  Remember the purpose of this stat is to measure how producitve a hitter is at getting himself on base.  If you reached on an error you did not get yourself on base.

Cherry_bas    -- 05-10-2004 @ 5:01 PM
  And what about Sacrifice Hit?

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hoopdreams_wi    -- 05-11-2004 @ 9:52 AM
  A Sacrifice Hit (Bunt) does not count as an at-bat, so therefore it would not affect either your batting average or your on-base percentage.

A Sacrifice Fly also does not count as an at-bat, so it does not affect your batting average.  However, as you see in the formula above, it is included for the purpose of on-base percentage.  A Sac Fly would lower your on-base percentage.

AtlantaBlue    -- 05-11-2004 @ 5:41 PM
  I never understood why that is.

MBNJ    -- 05-11-2004 @ 10:16 PM
  Dear Atlanta Blue:

A major difference between calculating a batting average or slugging percentage as opposed to an on-base percentage is that hitting a sacrifice fly does not adversely effect a batters batting average or his slugging percentage, but it hurts a batters on-base percentage.

The reason why this is so would seem to come from the fact that, by definition, a sacrifice bunt must be executed intentionally. In fact, under Rule 10.09(d), a scorekeeper is instructed to withhold credit for a sacrifice bunt if he or she believes that the batter was bunting primarily for a base hit and not for the purpose of advancing a runner or runners.

On the other hand, a batter is credited with a sacrifice fly without any regard to what his intent may have been. Simply put, if he fulfills the criteria for being awarded a sacrifice fly under Rule 10.09(e), the scorekeeper must credit him with a sacrifice fly. Intent is not a factor. Intent is altogether irrelevant.

On-base percentage is all about getting on base. If a batter manages to do so, whether its on a base hit, or a walk, or by being hit by a pitch, he is considered as having been successful. If he does so by virtue of a fielding error (in most instances) or a fielders choice, from a statistical standpoint he is viewed as having failed. If he doesnt get on base at all, he is (naturally) also looked upon as having fallen short. However, if, and only if, the batters failure to reach base was 100% and without any doubt intended (as it is the case with sacrifice bunts), his failure - in that limited category only - is ignored. Consequently, since a sacrifice fly is not, by definition, a volitional act on the part of the batter who hits it, it is not overlooked in Rule 10.22(f)s formula for calculating on-base percentage.

Does that help?

AtlantaBlue    -- 05-12-2004 @ 8:35 AM
  I think that is a very good explanation, I'm just not sure I entirely agree with the philosophy.

Yes a batter may get a Sac Fly on a ball he was just intending to hit, and therefore "failed" to get on base with his efforts.  But in today's game, particularly in MLB, I would guess (and that's all it is, a guess) that most Sac Flies are "planned" on being just that, a concerted effort to hit a ball high enough in the air and far enough away to allow the runner to tag, knowing that the chance of anything else positive for the batter (i.e., ball carrying over the fence for an HR) is slim, justas it is on a sac bunt.

I appreciate the explanation, and it was done well (I understood it the first time through, not always possible with some explanations on this or other boards, mine included!).  I'm just not sure the philosophy is entirely correct.

hoopdreams_wi    -- 05-12-2004 @ 12:28 PM
  Nice to know that if the pitcher plants a 98 MPH rawhide in my ear hole, that my OBP will go up.  Great job putting my head in front of that thing, huh?

Of course if I lift a fly ball to deep center to win the game in the bottom of the ninth, it will go down.

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